Looks like I get linked from b92.net every few weeks by some angry, I'm thinking teenager (hopefully) with Serbian roots posting from the USA. It's really boosting site traffic and I appreciate the all the comments - especially the furious ones. Keep em coming!
Don't have much to say, but the last "last post" has been up for far too long. Gotta post something :)
@Doot: You can do much better in bashing Serbia. I can't believe that there was nothing to inspire you to write several months. Is it possible that nothing sucked in Serbia all that time?
ReplyDeleteJust came across your blog and read it with much interest....and when I say much interest, I mean I read most of the posts simply thinking 'how typical'.
ReplyDeleteI don't come from Serbia, but I have been there. In fact I have visited many countries, especially in Africa - that are in a far more dire situation than Serbia is.
All I can say is - thank God I don't have your self righteous attitude of approaching that which is not the 'true western world' with total slander - I would have missed out on many adventures and life lessons due to being hunched over a computer and bitching!!
As many say - its a free world and you have free reign to have such a blog that is dedicated to complete and utter negativity. I just must admit I feel nothing but pity for people like yourself, of which there are many in my country....angry little minions hammering out as many insults that they can on computer keyboards whilst not changing their own situation. Its a narcissist that thrives on this type of thing, cheap thrills.
The entire world is in a state of chaos - America is not the land of milk and honey, nor is the UK, Germany or any other of the first world countries. There are many third world countries from Serbia to India, to many of the African and Asian countries that have huge *black dots* against their names for a number of reasons...many of which have greater issues than change problems when buying a pizza.
However unlike you, I tend to try and find something positive - as well as DO something positive rather than be on an eternal fault finding mission.
None the less - I doubt anything that is said to you hits any remote emotion or thought, you thrive far too much on getting people excited/angry/upset, after all - isn't that your entire point - your not doing anything constructive - your far more into destruction and pushing to get a rise out of people! I wont bother checking back here for a reply - Im not a fan of those who much like a mosquito thrive on sucking the life blood and energy out of those in poor situations...but I will say, you should go to Africa some time, it could fuel your negativity for ten of your lifetimes....and id love to see your blog after spending a day with a RPG stuck in your face, actually Id love to be a fly on the wall - to see if you have the same attitude as you do on your blog in the real world without your cyber-protection!
@Anonymous: Very well said.
ReplyDelete@Doot: It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.
Doot - Keep them coming please!
ReplyDeleteThis shit is therapy for me too even though I have to deal with the Serbian problems in the Canadian diaspora. It's very eye opening to hear a voice of reason coming from the purgatorial/hellish (hopefully purgatorial) battleground.
Your opinions loudly resonate with mine. While I thankfully don't have experience dealing with the everyday inconveniences of living in Serbia (I hear about them from my cousin), I am very much challenged by the mind-blowing delusional ways of our people.
Have you watched the movie Balkanski Spijun? IMO it's the most brilliant summary of the Serbian problem. It speaks volume that in Serbia this movie is widely considered an innocuous comedy.
I love Balkanski Špijun. Fantastic film. I've met (and had as landlords) my share of lija Čvorovićes
DeleteWhy are you bothering with this stuff in Canada, though? Hopefully, you're an immigrant. If not, find a better social circle :)
I'm not bothering with the stuff in Canada any more than I have to. Can't exclude parents and such from the social circle. But yeah I have changed a lot of friends because of this.
ReplyDeleteI don't know about your experience with Serbian diaspora, but there's a whole other irony here. You see in Serbia the people, no matter how stubbornly delusional, still have to wake up every morning and face the social consequences of their culture in the form of dysfunctional society. This tempers them a little and helps especially the younger generation question whether the Serbs really "invented the fork".
In North America in contrast, the Serbs arrive to a faraway land of peace and prosperity. The distance allows them to forget the misery they escaped or to engage in historical revisionism about how things weren't so bad ("Yugoslavia was the best country in the world..."). And the peace and prosperity allows them to go all-out full-throttle on their delusions without fearing the social consequences of doing so. It's Canada - no matter how nutty your political opinions are, it won't affect the country because Serbians are an insignificant minority. This is why in the diaspora you will find the most brazen forms of Serbian-style denial of reality.
Also you have these 2nd generation Serbian kids who never knew the reality of living in Serbia and who happily take up all the bullshit their parents feed them. Ultimately in the American system they become this bizarre mix of hippies (anti-government) and fascists (ultra-nationalists).
And also thanks for the Croatia and Montenegro sucks too blog. It's hard to express your opinions to a Serb without them assuming you are on the side of Croats or Muslims or something. No - I'm not. They all have exact same issues.
Thankfully, I grew up in a place without a big ex-yu community.
DeletePeople who look to their ancestral communities in Canada and the USA have a social disability, imo. Instead of finding people you have common interests with (if you know what your own interests are), looking to bond with people whose grandparents came from the same place seems a bit silly. In the North American context especially, I see no difference between someone liking you because you have Serbian heritage and someone disliking you for the same reason.
Cultural identification with your ancestral homeland in the USA/Canada/Australia can create a pretty strange creature. A strange kind of narcissism completely disconnected with any kind of reality. You're absolutely right about being able to go full-throttle into delusionality without any sort of reality-check. I've seen the situation here of people with Serbian ancestry getting mad at actual Serbs because they're not Serb enough. as ridiculous as it is sad.
Also, you have the issue of Canada taking in lots of refugees that wouldn't have normally gotten in.
You can see a lot of this delusionality on Serbian news sites that have an english section. Just read all the comments from all the big Serbs who've been to Serbia once or twice. You can see a few comments on this blog too like that.
oh ya... I was going to say, but I forgot.
DeleteIn The Sopranos, they touch on this a little a few times. When the crew goes to Italy and they don't like it, plus they are a little surprised that no one gives a crap that they're Italians. LOL
Plus, again, when they have the issue over Christopher Columbus when Furio tries to tell them that actual Italians don't worship Columbus much and they just sort of ignore him
I have to disagree with you about there being no point of associating with people of your own heritage. Besides there being a point, it's also quite unavoidable. In Canada for example, this is widespread with people of all kinds of European and other backgrounds maintaining their ethnic identity. In US I would say that the degree of assimilation is higher since America has a stronger national identity of its own. But even in America you have well-assimilated and distinct groups: Italians, Jews, WASPs, Latinos, all stable heritage-based groups. Anyways, this is a big social topic in North America beyond the scope of this blog.
DeleteI'd just say that there are two distinct ways of running a heritage-based community. There's the isolated/delusional way, and then there's the way where the community is in the open dialog with the rest of the humanity that lives in the same city and country.
Somehow I managed to avoid it, and thank goodness for that.
DeleteYes, Italians are a great study on how an ethnic group of immigrants with "rough" ways and a culture that was totally inconsistent with what they found in USA found its way in the USA. And today they are celebrated in shows like the Sopranos and are considered an enrichment to American culture - pizza, Frank Sinatra, etc..
Deleteanyway... be sure to show your friends my blog :)
Deletelol - I don't think so, I'm enough of a black sheep as it is. :)
DeleteMaybe one day, you'll leave the cult and be able to stand on your own big-boy feet ;)
Delete@Doot: Your problem is that you are biased by your own admission (otherwise your blog would not be entitled "Serbia sucks"). Your depiction is not truthful as it is committed to selecting only negatives. Regarding Serbians abroad, I met different people. I met somebody who, although left Serbia when he was 30, (claimed that he) did not speak Serbian. Thus, I spoke, at the same time, English with him and Serbian with his wife (third generation American). I met people proud to have Serbian heritage and those who were ashamed of it. Balkanski Spijun is an excellent depiction of reality, but it does not mean that Serbia sucks. On the contrary, it is evidence of movements in the right direction.
ReplyDeletenot sure what you mean by 'biased'. everyone is biased.
DeleteHowever, let's get one thing straight: I didn't hate Serbia before I came here. I don't hate Serbia because of something I heard on BBC or CNN. I hate Serbia because I've lived here for 5 years and have to see ever day what a broken, screwed-up place this is, inhabited by broken screwed-up people.
@Doot: I am not saying that this is not your experience. I am certain that it is. You are obviously not adopted well to your new place of living. However, maybe it is your fault? In different places, thinks function differently. Did you expect that Serbia will adopt to you? Do you now understand the true meaning of word "outsider"? You don't stand a chance if you don't know how things are really done.
ReplyDelete"adapt" not adopt.
DeleteNo, it's not my fault that Serbia sucks.
Yes, I have adapted as best I can to this dysfunctional environment (my adopted country). Yes, I know how things are done and I do them that way. No, learning how to do things the stupid way doesn't make them any less stupid.
cue..... "you just haven't met the right people"
Delete@Doot: I am astonished that you lasted 5 years. Without being connected, coming from a place where written lows are usually important, not having real friends, not knowing the system inside-out, you are a genuine outsider and easy pray. I like you. I like your naivety.
ReplyDeleteI'm a lone cowboy in the wild east! :D
Delete@Doot: I am glad that you are successful and that you try to change things in Serbia for better. You can become politically active and really help. Serbia certainly need people who would like to improve her and know how.
ReplyDeletep.s. sorry for adopt-adapt. You can amend this if you have this option.
ha :)
DeleteSerbian politics is a scam. No one can "really help" until you change your electoral system.
No successful country has the system you do.
You vote for a party, but the party selects who is in parliament. Therefore, parliamentarians are beholden not to the electorate but to their party bosses.
This system of fake, theatre democracy is Serbia's biggest problem, imo
@Doot: You mean "our electoral system"; for me you are one of us. I don't think that the system is a problem. In nineties, the system was the one you propose, and it didn't cover itself in glory. There is a school of thought saying "od govana se pita ne moze napraviti" (rubbish in, rubbish out). Ljudi su najvazniji. Ti si momak u pravim godinama da pomognes. Znam da hoces.
ReplyDeleteyou're free to consider me anything you like, but it's not my electoral system as I am not part of the electorate, ie, not a citizen.
Delete@Doot: I think that it should be (relatively) easy for you to get Serbian citizenship.
DeleteIt wouldn't be that hard. I looked into it. I'd have to request some documents from some archives. When I first came here, I did some of the steps. I stopped when it came to the archives when I realized that Serbian citizenship doesn't help me and makes me vulnerable in some ways. I've decided against it.
Delete@Doot: Usually it is better to have citizenship of a place that you live in than not to. The only apparent "disadvantage" of a Serbian citizenship that I know of is that you would not be entitled to a consular help from a country of your second citizenship. Nevertheless, the point is that you can get Serbian citizenship whenever you like. My prediction is that Serbia will go from strength to strength. Every time when I visit Belgrade, things are better than the last time.
ReplyDeleteI think you're looking through rose-colored glasses.
DeleteThings aren't getting better, they've gotten considerably worse since I've been here. More unemployed, lower salaries, rent has dropped about 30% since I've gotten here (all good things for me, but not a sign that things are good.
I do think that Serbia has potential, but it's not going to be realized for some time to come and things certainly aren't getting better, they're getting quite worse and will continue to do so
@Doot: In my opinion, living standard in Serbia in 2008 was unrealistically good for the state of the economy (and still it is too good). It is fair to say that this also happens elsewhere; standard in UK now is significantly worse than in 2008. However, my impression is that people in Serbia are better than ever. Services that I received last summer in shops, restaurants etc. were second to none.
ReplyDeleteI'm not comparing 2013 to 2008. I'm comparing 2013 to 2012, and 2012 to 2011, and 2011 to 2010
DeleteIf you think things are getting better in Serbia (based on having a cheerful waiter during one of your short visits), you are simply wrong. Things are worse and worse every year for the average Serbian.
I take no pleasure in telling you this. this also means more and pettier scams that one must endure on an almost daily basis, so no good for me either.
You must have heard it a thousand times. F**k off then.
ReplyDeleteas in "if you don't like it, leave"?
Deletehttp://serbia-sucks.blogspot.com/2013/08/if-you-dont-like-it-get-out.html
dude, you really need to write an article about "Belgrade women are the most beautiful in the world". I know this overlaps with Belgrade nightlife which you already wrote about, but it's still it's own subject. You can throw in more stuff about Serbian attitude on looks, like how Serbs are the tallest people in the world, amazing at sports, etc.
ReplyDeleteSerbian women do tend to be more attractive than average, on average, imo, so I'm not sure what I would say on that. I'm not sure about "the most beautiful in the world", but definitely nice looking.
Delete@Doot: You have to be careful what you write so that the content is in accord with the blog title. Otherwise, you will be forced to change the title (Serbia Rocks possibly?).
DeleteI'm glad to see that you are running lower on bile, tis the season to be jolly after all. While I certainly don't disagree that Serbian women are hot, there's still a lot cynical stuff to be said about it being used as a major selling point when pitching Belgrade as a tourist destination (see "sex tourism")... But I guess you don't find inspiration, inspiration finds you, so,
DeleteSrecan Bozic!
...and their violent derision of what they consider physical unattractiveness
ReplyDelete@Doot: Nothing wrong with changing the title. Probably, the best approach is to be objective. To tell about good and bad. ("My life in Serbia").
ReplyDeleteMan I had a chance to read a couple of your blog posts and there is one thing that puzzles me, why are you still here? I mean it's quite clear that everything here makes you miserable, the people, the way of life everything. So why not just end the misery and find happiness somewhere else and this is not a "like it or leave it" type of thing, man this is for your own sake, enjoy life, find people that you can live with, Serbia is bad for you!
ReplyDeleteMan, I hope the projects are worth it!
DeleteBiggest load of bullshit i've ever heard. Go fuck yourself. Sincererly, a Croatian.
ReplyDelete@Doot: Samo da ti pruzim podrsku. I sam znas da se uglavnom ne slazem sa tobom, ali cu se uvek boriti da mozes slobodno da kazes sta mislis. Oces li da ides na rukomet sutra (zbog atmosphere)? Sigurno ce sa Brazilom biti ludnica.
ReplyDeletesam znam da ne slažeš samnom?
DeleteYou're just another "anonymous". You think I keep some sort of chart figuring out who the various anonymouses are?
I am here as a Serb just to confirm that Serbia sucks.
ReplyDeleteDude,I feel your pain!! I am at my wits' end,slowly sinking into depression.
ReplyDeleteHaven't lived here for some time,and I've forgotten who bad things actually are. The other day I went to the bank to get a new card and they informed me that it would take them three weeks to issue me a bloody card! I'm yet to set up online banking,for some reason I have a feeling it will not go that easy.
People behave as if nothing is wrong,or at least as if nothing is Serbia's fault. Everyone keeps telling me to go out to calm down. What's the deal with this nightlife obsession? The clubs are average,most places don't accept credit cards (very annoying) and I can't go out with a college or a fried as there is a "minimum of 5" for a booking. Yes,it is cheap,but if you live on Serbian wages,then it's actually quote expensive. I'm really trying to stay positive and look on the bright side,but it's getting harder every day!!
I've noticed you don't write as often,have you found a way to cope? If so,do tell!
@Anonymous: I am shocked that there is digital banking in Serbia. Are you serious? If it is true, this is incredible progress. I still vividly remember a commercial for "Visa" some 15 years ago (in the USA) and punch-line "it can be used even in Ireland".
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
Delete@Katarina: Zao mi je sto si izbrisala komentar na moj komentar. Slobodno kazi sta imas, bice mi drago da ti odgovorim.
ReplyDeleteI was born in Belgrade and am still living in it. Found out your blog a couple of days ago when I was browsing through results I've got on "role of Germany in dissolution of Yugoslavia", and as I don't feel particularly patriotic and have no problems reading negative comments on Serbia and its people, I proceeded reading your blog.
ReplyDeleteWhile some of the things you pointed here are actually true (post about paying bills for example) and I share your frustration, I quickly became disappointed just for the fact that you are deliberately looking for bad things in anything and you are expressing it in such a exaggerating manner that one, who's reading it, losses its point. For example this post: http://serbia-sucks.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2012-01-01T00:00:00%2B01:00&updated-max=2013-01-01T00:00:00%2B01:00&max-results=4
I agree that mostly losers are hanging out in a free shop, so, what for god's sake have you been doing there? And not even that, but also stalking random people? This post, let a few other alone, made me feel tasteless, even others that I agreed with you.
Please, try to be, at least, more creative in your silly and shallow blathering. You are showing a typical, but severe case of Serbian trolling, tired of drinking his coffee everyday at noon, without nothing serious to work. Of course, unless you already is Serbian, which is more likely...
Reading you posts is a waste of time and thank you for wasting 15 minutes of my life. I will now go back to Teofil Pancic or Dubravka Stojanovic, writers that interact with people, have social life and depth in their thoughts.
I don't know what you're talking about when you say "free shop" and "stalking random people"
DeleteExcept that the post about paying bills is a big lie. You guys are implying that German, Italian, Greek, Russian, Serbian, Belgian, etc. banks suck. I mean you can blame inefficiency of public sector in Serbia but blaming whole banking sector seems idiotic.
DeleteI don't think you guys know how paying bills work, all you need is the number of the bill ( "ziro racun" which you get in your mailbox or by internet if you synchronized that with your local bank) and you just use whatever service you like. You don't need to pay bills in the same building you got your bill from.
You didn't read the story.
DeleteI was living in a place where they changed the street name and every second month they'd send the bill to a different address. I'd have to then go to the main Telekom building every 2 months to get a print-out of the bill, then to a post office to pay it, then back to Telekom to prove that I had paid. There was always a line of 10-15 people going through the same thing.
As for whether things are better now than in 2011 when I wrote that, maybe. I'm told so. My bank says I need to pay a 300e deposit for the privilege of online banking account. I'd still be withdrawing USD, running across the street to change my money, going back to the bank to deposit dinars so that I can do online banking.
and yes, it is Serbia's fault and not the foreign banks that this situation is ridiculous.
All of this stuff can be done from your laptop in any country without having to go into a bank
Next time open "DEVIZNI RACUN !!!", not "ziro racun", it's easy as that and also free of charge.
DeleteAnd about the Telekom, well whole public sector sucks in Serbia, can't argue with that but you could have called some superior there and said to him that the name of the street changed. Serbia doesn't have centralized system. Btw. centralization is good to propose it to our ministers, it's an easy fixable problem.
Also there was another solution to this problem you had.
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=racun+za+telefon
Doot likes to blame somebody else for his own shortcomings. "Losem kurcu i dlaka smeta"?
Delete@Doot: Do you read what you post on this blog?
ReplyDeleteno
DeleteClever
ReplyDeleteZdravo :) (as you can see, I'm from Serbia, I'm 22 years old student). I know that many things are fucked up here in Serbia (btw, do you live in Belgrade?) and that there is corruption, bad employment, low paychecks, etc... But, things are slowly becoming better, at least that is what I believe and what I feel. And, I want to ask you, how well do you know Serbian history? It would help you a lot to understand the situation and maybe even appreciate country and people (especially the people, because they've been through lot). Anyway, I prefer to think that it doesn't matter where you are, but what you do. Hope I helped.
ReplyDeleteAna
Evo, sad cu na srpkom. Nisam mislila na to kada sam rekla da treba da procitat istoriju. Nego sam mislila da je
DeleteSrbija bila do pre 2 veka pod Turskom, i da jesu isla sranja za sranjem, a ne da je "Beograd centar sveta". Daleko od toga. Najveci uspeh Srbije i Srba jeste to sto jos uvek opstaju.
Ali Srbija je drzava koja ne zna kako voditi drzavu, a i kako bi, kada osim toliko godina ropstva, posle toga samo krecu ratovi, glupi ratovi za koje Srbija je Srbija bila suvise bedna, i samo je gubila.
Nisu ljudi bas toliko glupi, niti misle da je Beograd sentar sveta.
I consider sometimes making a post about how Serbs have, over and over, since 1989, played "all or nothing" over and over and kept getting "nothing", yet continuing (as they continue today) to play "all or nothing" and end up with nothing.
DeleteBut, I'm not sure I want to get too political.
I agree that Serbs don't know how to run a country. Unfortunately, this is a main reason why Serbia needs to join the EU. It needs an outside blueprint to fix itself along with carrots and sticks forcing it sometimes kicking and screaming into the 20th century
I da, izvinjavam se na greskama, brzo sam kucala.
DeleteAli ono najtuznije je da sta god da Vi osecate zbog Srbije, stvarno ne znate kako je narodu i koliko je napacen i razocaran u sopstvenu drzavu... Vi imate dovoljno vremena da se ubedjujete sa ljudima preko interneta, i da vodite ovakav blog? Iskreno, draze bi mi bilo da radite nesto pametnije i korisnije. Toliko truda, a zbog cega? Bolje čitajte ili gledajte filmove, druzite se s ljudima... Ili nastavite da vodite beskoristan blog. Nadam se da necete (opet) pogresno protumaciti moje odgovore.
Srecno!
Ana
it's not an either-or situation.
DeleteI can watch a film and also spend 5 mins making a post on this blog when my frustration boils over
PS. About EU and running country: Nobody who wants to be in politics and who wants to run the county deserves to do it. That's what I think.
DeleteAnd all politics in the world can be divided in two types:
Ether you are country with good politics for your own country (but bad VERY bad for other countries - like America), or you just have bad politics for your own country (like Serbia) :)
I disagree that American politics is good for America.
DeleteProblem with Serbian politics is that it's designed so that no one can get into it. Serbia has a political class. In Serbia, you vote for a party and parliamentarians are selected by the party. This is pretend democracy. The people in parliament aren't beholden to the people, but to their party.
PPS: If we join EU, nothing will change, nobody would voluntary learn us how to run country and make us better- why would they? No country helps other country, not really. America sure didn't help Libya, for example. But, what do I know...
Deleteyou're wrong about that (mostly). EU ascension is a process that forces developing countries to reform their bureaucracy, their judiciary, and their government to modern standard. This has been the case with all former communist countries to various success.
Delete@Doot: I commend your attempt to impress a 22 year-old student. Your thoughts are as deep as your expertise in politics and history. Maybe you will get lucky?
ReplyDeletefeel free to disagree with anything I say
DeleteDoot you are officialy one of my favourite persons in the world.I share the same toughts about Serbia,but sadly I live in Serbia.I think that Serbia is a nation of awful people and I am not proud to be one.But hopefully if everything works fine,I'm gonna move to America in four years.But until then I can just wait and read your awesome blog while I'm at It.
ReplyDelete@Anonymous: Your problem is that you know only one side of the coin. You should compare Serbia and USA after living at least 10 years in the USA. At the moment, you don't know what are you talking about.
ReplyDeleteI can tell you, Serbia sucks even more after 10 years in the USA. If you allow yourself to open your eyes, of course. Some people choose to stay blind.
Delete@Anonymous January 13,2014 at 8:56 PM that's just my oppinion so go back to loving your preciouss Serbia and USA is the best and some dick head Serbs can't accept it!!!!!!!!!!
Delete